Who eats what?

[poison idea]

do you fit into any of these boxes?
why and for how long?

let's not yell and point fingers at start the who walks the moral hi ground blah blah and ridicule one another. i'm just curious. i remember this popping up last winter.

terms:
ovo eats eggs but no dairy
lacto does dairy but no eggs
vegetarians do eggs and dairy
vegans abstain from all animal products

[rockhound]

What's the opposite of a vegan?

[tryandgetme]

if it moves I'll eat it?

[mimbresman]

My wife is the true carnosaur in the family. She loves beef and pork. I prefer chicken. We both like fish. She makes a killer fish soup...made some on Sunday.
I more often opt for meatless meals, i.e., pestos, cheese, bread, pasta, etc., whereas she'll go for some kind of meat protein in her dishes.

[rockyrider]

omnivore and fairly happy with my place in the food chain... :D

And the angel of the Lord came unto me, snatching me up from my place of slumber. And took me on high, and higher still until we moved to the spaces betwixt the air itself. And he brought me into a vast farmlands of our own midwest. And as we descended, cries of impending doom rose from the soil. One thousand, nay a million voices full of fear. And terror possesed me then. And I begged, "Angel of the Lord, what are these tortured screams?" And the angel said unto me, "These are the cries of the carrots, the cries of the carrots! You see, Reverend Maynard, tomorrow is harvest day and to them it is the holocaust." And I sprang from my slumber drenched in sweat like the tears of one million terrified brothers and roared, "Hear me now, I have seen the light! They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers!" Can I get an amen? Can I get a hallelujah? Thank you Jesus.

[Jay13]

I voted for carnosaur, even though I eat much more fish and seafood than red meat. I think that label is a bit derogatory though, since it indicates that someone who eats meat is primitive. Since this thread was started by a vegan, isn't that a bit cliche?

On the other hand, I've been a Chef and Culinary Educator for almost 15 years, and i've really only been encountering true vegans for the past five years or so. Most of them smoke cigarettes and do other equally unsavory things, but they don't eat meat... I always wondered about that. I guess its just one of many "extreme" lifestyles...

From a Culinary standpoint though, meat is overrated. Most people that eat it do so way too much and in quantities that are 3-4 times a single portion... But then again America has that obesity epidemic and all... to me, Fish is where it's at... But then you gotta worry about mercury... Hell, we're all screwed.... I'm gonna go get me a steak and be done with it...

And Poison, i'm not trying to ridicule, just making an observation...

MMMM...MMMM... tasty...

[billwilliams70]

Gimme the meat. Love a good filet. I also eat the veggies as well.

Later.

[Goride]

Vegetarian that eats fish.

Thats me.

Been that way for maybe five years now. Feels great.

[poison idea]

i f'd up making the poll. i meant to put in a "I eat a decent balance of meat n veggies" but forgot. Carnasaur was to be for those folks that subsist almost exclusively on meat. tried to fix it, but i'm an idiot or it's not possible or both. if anyone knows how to add a question, let me know and i'll fix it

Jay, i've honestly never met a vegan i could stand for more than 15 minutes.

Goride, that a pescetarian.

[tryandgetme]

i f'd up making the poll. i meant to put in a "I eat a decent balance of meat n veggies" but forgot.

Added it for ya. Merry Christmas.

[poison idea]

good lookin out :) thanks

[phlatlander]

Now I need to change my vote, as I LOVE my fruits & veggies - like Mimbresman, I prefer fish & breast of chicken, but we were recently given 30+ lbs of home grown steer, so tacos, chili, stuffed peppers etc have been on order.

I work in the produce industry, so I like to keep job security & consume as much produce as the USDA allows. I could eat fresh garden tomatoes every meal until the skin dissolved from the inner lining of my mouth. Everyone else in my family can't stand them, which is wonderful for me. Is it dinner time?

[xjoex]

I'm a veg that eats cheese. Been one now for 15 years.

Oh and I was vegan for four years but it got to be too much work. I was lazy I guess.

rock on,

-Joe

[rockyrider]

me too, I voted carnosaur 'cause I still eat red meat maybe 5-6 times a month. I vote for the last choice...

[DirtRagArt]

Added it for ya. Merry Christmas.

Good to see you using your powers for good, not evil.

[tryandgetme]

just giving back to the community that's put up with me for so long *sniff ;)

[Jay13]

Jay, i've honestly never met a vegan i could stand for more than 15 minutes.

Me neither... pains in the ass actually...

:D :D :D

[davkatreb]

Is beer a food group?

[fxdwhl]

Vegan for about 2 years now. Veg for a year before that. Traveling can be tough and I do my best. Still stay veg though. Only vice is beer.

Never been in better shape in my life and feel great.

[techne]

I was lacto-ovo-vegetarian for a few years before becoming vegan. I've got some pretty strong views about gastropolitics and environmental ethics, but in the spirit of the original post - "let's not yell and point fingers at start the who walks the moral hi ground blah blah and ridicule one another" - I'll avoid the temptation make any arguments here unless requested to. I would like to respond to a few posts though, in brief.

"On the other hand, I've been a Chef and Culinary Educator for almost 15 years, and i've really only been encountering true vegans for the past five years or so. Most of them smoke cigarettes and do other equally unsavory things, but they don't eat meat... I always wondered about that. I guess its just one of many "extreme" lifestyles..." (Jay13).

There have been 'true vegans' for a long time. The word 'vegan' was invented by a man in England who was troubled by those who called themselves vegetarians who ate cheese, milks, and other animal products. Up until the 20th century (in North America especially), 'vegetarian' denoted what we now call 'vegan' diet. The term 'vegan' was introduced in response to the watering down of the original term. In many other countries, 'vegetarian' still means what it always did, no animal products.

People come to veganism for all sorts of reasons. 'Ethical veganism' is just that, based on ethical considerations primarily. 'Lifestyle veganism' is more about personal health. So you can see how one might be an ethical vegan and smoke; it is not necessarily about one's own health (though I do not thinnk smoking is consistent with a philosophy of non-harm).

"Jay, i've honestly never met a vegan i could stand for more than 15 minutes" (Poison Idea).

As a vegan, I can say I have also met some annoying vegans. But I can also say that most of my friends didn't stop wanting to ride and hang with me once I became vegan. They didn't know until I told them. In other words, eating this or that does not make one tolerable or not. I really appreciate the fact that my friends for the most part respect my choice, and they have inquired into my motivation in good faith. I tend to temper my responses so as to keep from making them feel guilty. People who hit others over the head with their politics are always hard to take. Vegans who do this are not special in this regard. And unlike switching over from liberalism to socialism say, switching over from eating animal products to veganism impacts social interactions in a multitude of ways, from family get-togethers to work parties. This is an emotional issue for just about everyone; we are emotionally invested in our eating habits. This is the number one reason why people tend to get defensive when conversations that connect food and ethics arise (in my opinion).

[1mystk]

terms:
ovo eats eggs but no dairy
lacto does dairy but no eggs
vegetarians do eggs and dairy
vegans abstain from all animal products

Well as of late I have been doing the vegetarian thing, with some form of meat 1-2 times per week (beef or chicken for protein sources.) Being a serious meat and potatoes kind gal, I started eating more produce when my mom started working at Dominion 6 years ago in the produce dept. Also want to stay healthy and find other sources of proteins in veggies and fruit.

I am lactose intolerant - but do have a bowl of cereal 3 times a week with skim milk only. If not eating cereal it is oatmeal. Quaker, good for cholestoral levels and a healthy heart. And only eat cheddar cheese as the hard cheeses are better for those who suffer from Lactose intolerance. I do eggs sometimes, because eggs are a good sense of energy. But avoid too many yolks... whites are better.

And the only fish product is tuna... unless it is freshly caught I don't eat fish.

[OTBSkinloss]

Animals have two jobs. They have to taste good and be fashionable.

[Jay13]

I was lacto-ovo-vegetarian for a few years before becoming vegan. I've got some pretty strong views about gastropolitics and environmental ethics, but in the spirit of the original post - "let's not yell and point fingers at start the who walks the moral hi ground blah blah and ridicule one another" - I'll avoid the temptation make any arguments here unless requested to. I would like to respond to a few posts though, in brief.

"On the other hand, I've been a Chef and Culinary Educator for almost 15 years, and i've really only been encountering true vegans for the past five years or so. Most of them smoke cigarettes and do other equally unsavory things, but they don't eat meat... I always wondered about that. I guess its just one of many "extreme" lifestyles..." (Jay13).

There have been 'true vegans' for a long time. The word 'vegan' was invented by a man in England who was troubled by those who called themselves vegetarians who ate cheese, milks, and other animal products. Up until the 20th century (in North America especially), 'vegetarian' denoted what we now call 'vegan' diet. The term 'vegan' was introduced in response to the watering down of the original term. In many other countries, 'vegetarian' still means what it always did, no animal products.

People come to veganism for all sorts of reasons. 'Ethical veganism' is just that, based on ethical considerations primarily. 'Lifestyle veganism' is more about personal health. So you can see how one might be an ethical vegan and smoke; it is not necessarily about one's own health (though I do not thinnk smoking is consistent with a philosophy of non-harm).

"Jay, i've honestly never met a vegan i could stand for more than 15 minutes" (Poison Idea).

As a vegan, I can say I have also met some annoying vegans. But I can also say that most of my friends didn't stop wanting to ride and hang with me once I became vegan. They didn't know until I told them. In other words, eating this or that does not make one tolerable or not. I really appreciate the fact that my friends for the most part respect my choice, and they have inquired into my motivation in good faith. I tend to temper my responses so as to keep from making them feel guilty. People who hit others over the head with their politics are always hard to take. Vegans who do this are not special in this regard. And unlike switching over from liberalism to socialism say, switching over from eating animal products to veganism impacts social interactions in a multitude of ways, from family get-togethers to work parties. This is an emotional issue for just about everyone; we are emotionally invested in our eating habits. This is the number one reason why people tend to get defensive when conversations that connect food and ethics arise (in my opinion).

The quote feature works better than cut n' paste...

By the way, are you an "ethnical" veggie or a "lifestyle" veggie? And out of curiosity, why would it be unethical to consume cow's milk products or eggs? Neither hurts the animal as far as I can tell... Don't get me wrong, I know there are health reasons to avoid lactose, and all the cholesterol...

[kennbenny667]

I've been a vegetarian for about 8 months. I'm 30 pounds lighter, have lower everything, and I feel like a million bucks in the morning. No flesh of any kind, no gelatin or lard, rennet, and some other stuff too! I drink soy milk and eat a lot of fresh fruits and nuts. I still drink too much Mountain Dew.

I'm not a member of Peta. Peta is an aggressive animal rights organization, NOT a vegetarian organization!

I don't like most of the vegans I've personally met much either. Seems like most of the ones I know are Edge kids who just want to be more like Ian and less like their parents... but I guess the enemy of my enemy is my friend...

I could never become vegan, as I enjoy cheese and Merino wool too much.

The Vegan Rob article was an interesting read though. It helped me stop making excuses when my veggie will was wavering!
.02

[jorge]

Well as of late I have been doing the vegetarian thing, with some form of meat 1-2 times per week (beef or chicken for protein sources.) Being a serious meat and potatoes kind gal, I started eating more produce when my mom started working at Dominion 6 years ago in the produce dept. Also want to stay healthy and find other sources of proteins in veggies and fruit.


And the only fish product is tuna... unless it is freshly caught I don't eat fish.

Are you sure you didn't hit your head in one of your recent crashes? Vegetarian means nooo meat, fish, poultry, etc. Some vegetarians will eat eggs for protein but generally nothin with a face.

And I'm pretty sure there is no protein in fruits and if there is some weird fruit that has protein it would be negligible.

[peatbog]

Sorry, I eat dead animals every day. Actually, I'm not really sorry. I am hungry. Maybe I am sorry that I am hungry. Maybe I should just shut up. Okay, let it be written, let it be done!

[Jahnov]

My wife is a Nutritionist, so I had to vote for the balanced diet thing.

We eat very well. As for meat, about once a week we eat organic Moose or Venison, sometimes Caribou and Elk, and always with veggies. Her father is a hunter.

Soups are big in our house, as is fish twice a week minimum!

Good thread.

[davkatreb]

Vegan Rob
Doesn't he mow lawns or some such to pay for his tofu? Wonder how many living creatures he whacks in the course of a normal shift?

[davkatreb]

In other words, eating this or that does not make one tolerable or not.
Ain't been to my house on Chili Night, have you boy?

[kennbenny667]

Their can be no true vegan, only the Vegan Ideal!:rolleyes:

[davkatreb]

Their can be no true vegan, only the Vegan Ideal!:rolleyes:
Hmmm, yes, I suppose that's true. It's a pity more vegans don't grasp that concept. Perhaps they wouldn't be such insufferable dicks.

Could you imagine trying to grow tofu trees (or whatever plant you raise to produce your "food") without EVER causing harm to ANY living creature? Couldn't be done, I tell you what.

[OTBSkinloss]

Hmmm, yes, I suppose that's true. It's a pity more vegans don't grasp that concept. Perhaps they wouldn't be such insufferable dicks.

Could you imagine trying to grow tofu trees (or whatever plant you raise to produce your "food") without EVER causing harm to ANY living creature? Couldn't be done, I tell you what.

Careful Dave. Statements like that will get you 25 to 30 violent PM's and a threat of banishment. You aren't part of the special people.

[davkatreb]

Careful Dave. Statements like that will get you 25 to 30 violent PM's and a threat of banishment. You aren't part of the special people.
Hell, Monocod, I ain't ascairt. I was buckin' the tide before most folks hereabouts were in this world.

Beer?

[Ripp]

Hell, Monocod, I ain't ascairt. I was buckin' the tide before most folks hereabouts were in this world.

Beer?

Why yes I believe I will drink. (another that is!)

Jokes aside this is a good thread.

I just typed a semi long response and realized it would be changing the subject a bit too much. So I deleted it so as to not hijack! I'll form a thread one of these days for it.

[VRX200]

If it's under the "golden arches",,, I'll likely eat it!

[WunSpeedWunder]

Was "Under the golden arches" today,doesn't really bother me,KILLER GENES!!! That is what I've found is the key to food as I can eat all the crap I want & still survive a Pub run with The Budgie!! But do try to fit at least one serve of Roo a week( leanest steak on Earth,so they tell me ,who am I to argue if it tastes good . Funny how people won't eat it just because it hangs off one side of the Aussie Coat Of Arms.
Best if you wash it down with a Coopers ,too!!

[fxdwhl]

Hmmm, yes, I suppose that's true. It's a pity more vegans don't grasp that concept. Perhaps they wouldn't be such insufferable dicks.

Could you imagine trying to grow tofu trees (or whatever plant you raise to produce your "food") without EVER causing harm to ANY living creature? Couldn't be done, I tell you what.

Insufferable dicks come in all types. Vegan, straightedge, omnivore, cyclist, librarian, carpenter, triathelete, mechanic, truck driver, internet nerds...

Get the idea. People tend to get too defensive of their personal stances. Especially on the internet. If we'd all be sitting around having a couple of drinks most likely we'd all get along and be civil. Even while still having different ideals.

And as far as not harming anything in food production, yes it is impossible. Most ethical vegans are trying to limit the ammount of suffering, some get fanatical though. While my vegan ways are based more on personal health I do have stronge feelings about the food/meat industry.

[poison idea]

i start out as a health veggie and switched over to ethical vegan about 10 years ago. used to know a lot of hardline wankers. they mocked my drunkeness and i their fanatacism. now i'm 30 and still vegan and still drunk except now they're drunk and eating burgers. not sure if i'm built to last or too dumb to change.

there are no true vegans, just an ideal. you do the best you can.


Insufferable dicks come in all types. Vegan, straightedge, omnivore, cyclist, librarian, carpenter, triathelete, mechanic, truck driver, internet nerds...
truer words were never spoken

[hophead]

I am a hardcore carnivore. I love a big hunk of bloody red meat. There's very little in life better than a crusty ribeye seared over a hardwood charcoal fire.

[techne]

I screwed up when making the distinction between sorts of vegans in my original post. Goes to show I don't really think about those distinctions much. So here is what I should have said:

Ethical/lifestyle veganism - for ethical reasons, all animals and animal products are avoided, including honey, wool, leather, silk, gelatin...

Dietary veganism - for health/aesthetic reasons, consumption of all animals and animal products are avoided. One might still wear leather footwear though, for example.

To respond to the question as to which category I fit into, I'd have to say neither. I became vegan for ethical reasons, but my ethics are a little more nuanced than the black/white distinction reflected above. For example, I use wool. Why? Because shearing sheep does not necessarily harm them, it is a renewable 'resource', sheep can be treated with care and respect and offer their wool for human uses, petroleum based clothing is unfortunately produced in ecologically harmful ways. This is not to say that sheep do no harm. They do. I prefer to buy Merino from New Zealand, where sheep are the number one environmental problem. There are no perfect solutions. I treat my wool iterms with due respect.

Many ethical/lifestyle vegans are primarily concerned with animal rights. I am concerned more broadly with ecological issues - what is best overall. This complicates things; I don't have simple rules to follow. For example, I had to get new hiking boots last year. I didn't want to get leather (the argument here is that cow leather sales subsidize the beef industry, thereby reducing the cost and allowing an inflated rate of consumption, not to mention the harms associated with the tanning process), but my options were extremely limited in the synthetic milieu. I reasoned that the leather boots would last longer than the synthetic option (which was produced through 'dirty' precesses), so they would have a lesse ecological impact. I'm not sure I am right about this. I might have simply been rationalizing what I wanted to do. If another were to provide an argument to this effect, I would have to concede. I feel obligated to make these boots last as long as possible by caring for them as well as I can.

I find it pretty easy most of the time to eat well as a vegan. Sometimes I might have someting with butter or egg in it without knowing it. That's life. I agree that it is more of an ideal, something to aim for rather than a reality. We do what we can with good intentions. I can also say that I have never been healthier than I am now, and I have become faster and leaner since I became vegan. My two year old daughter is also vegan, and she is flourishing. A balanced diet does not require consuming animals and animal products.

[INDIGOSKY]

And out of curiosity, why would it be unethical to consume cow's milk products or eggs? Neither hurts the animal as far as I can tell...

Since you asked... From "Milk Myths":

>Milk is made by happy cows who live on beautiful family farms.

While TV ads depict rolling green fields the reality of the modern dairy farm could not be more different. Every year more and more small family operations go out of business and are replaced by an increasing number of factory farms. Most dairy cows live in fields where every inch is covered by their own fecal matter. These fields support thousands of cows who make A LOT of fecal matter. Most are herded into large milking barns where they are milked by machines. Overproduction is a regular aspect of the modern dairy industry making antibiotics and hormones all necessary for maintaining this unnatural industry.

>Cows give milk to us.

Small farms often portray their relationships with dairy cows as pleasant sharing relationships implying that cows give their milk to humans. Of course cows never intend to give their milk to anyone but there babies. Through genetic manipulation and intensive production technologies the dairy industry averages 100 pounds of milk a day per cow, which is well beyond the rate they would give to there babies naturally. This causes another dairy industry disease called "Milk Fever." The ailment is caused by calcium deficiency, and it occurs when milk secretion depletes calcium faster than it can be replenished in the blood.

>It's not like it hurts the cow.

Most dairy products come from large factory farms where the cows are connected to huge milking machines. This is a painful process which often results in infections like Mastitis. In addition to the many diseases caused by dairy production, dairy cows make 20 to 40 times as much waste as humans, they live in most cases in fields covered by there own fecal matter.

>No Animals are killed or suffer for dairy products.

Many vegetarians who still consume dairy products don't realize just how much suffering is involved in dairy production. Dairy cows are still slaughtered for meat, most often at four years of age when their bodies are too worn out to produce high milk yields (the natural lifespan of a cow is 25 years). While slaughter for meat is awful dairy cows live lives of protracted misery. Kept in a constant cycle of pregnancy, lactation and milking by machines, approximately half of all dairy cows live with chronic Mastitis.

[fxdwhl]

Well said Techne. You summed up a lot of my ideals.

[free spirit]

>It's not like it hurts the cow.

Most dairy products come from large factory farms where the cows are connected to huge milking machines. This is a painful process which often results in infections like Mastitis. In addition to the many diseases caused by dairy production, dairy cows make 20 to 40 times as much waste as humans, they live in most cases in fields covered by there own fecal matter.



Have you ever milked a cow? By hand or machine? It doesn't hurt them. If it did, the cow wouldn't stand for it. As for mastitis, as a former 'milk producer' myself, any critter that produces milk can get mastitis. Dairy cows don't produce any more waste than any other animal their size.



>No Animals are killed or suffer for dairy products.

Many vegetarians who still consume dairy products don't realize just how much suffering is involved in dairy production. Dairy cows are still slaughtered for meat, most often at four years of age when their bodies are too worn out to produce high milk yields (the natural lifespan of a cow is 25 years). While slaughter for meat is awful dairy cows live lives of protracted misery. Kept in a constant cycle of pregnancy, lactation and milking by machines, approximately half of all dairy cows live with chronic Mastitis.

Dairy cows are not all used up by 4 yrs of age. They are just becoming fully mature by that point. Cows aren't bred until they are around 2yrs of age. They aren't 'genetically manipulated', they are selectively bred just like every other animal that has had humans raising it, i.e. the wolf becomes the friendly family labrador. To say that they are genetically manipulated is to imply that they are genetically engineered.

The only time cows are sent to the slaughterhouse is when they are old. Though many calves can be sold to veal producers, which is a different matter.

The only cows that have chronic mastitis are those being handled by farmers with poor sanitation habits. A clean barn is a healthy barn.

Sorry for the thread jack.

I eat food. All kinds. Variety is key to staying healthy. I limit fish to what I have, or a friend has caught. Many lakes and rivers around here have mercury health warnings, many farm raised fish also have high levels of contaminants, so I like to know where my fish comes from. And I tend to stay away from meats that have alot of fat in them.

Lunch time!

[Jay13]

Yawn...

I guess I'm just a cold blooded killer. :eek:

(burps after eating tasty flesh....)

Thanks for the veggie propaganda indigo...:rolleyes:

[PutAwayWet]

I only eat meat that comes from my parents' farm. Those are some seriously pampered and spoiled cows and chickens, let me tell you. I have more of a problem with the commercial farming/livestock system than with eating meat. That said, probably 1 meal a week has meat in it. This wasn't part of the poll, but I now buy almost exclusively organic at the supermarket, too. Vote with your wallet! :)

[Jay13]

I have more of a problem with the commercial farming/livestock system than with eating meat.

I agree with this completely. I was just being sarcastic in my last post... :o Sometimes its hard not to be...

[American_Lesion]

I survive on TaB, vanilla soy milk, and Kashi.

Is there a specific word for that sort of diet?

Okay, so I was doing the a little fish, limited dairy, and mostly vegetarian thing over the course of the summer. I ate hummus until what went in looked more or less like what came out.

And you know what? I felt freaking great. I happen to have RTA-II (Renal Tubular Acidosis Type 2), a kidney condition that makes me crank out the stones like they're on buy-one-get-one special at the local Safeway, and I suspect a lot of the folks posting here are diet-conscious enough to know that meat proteins are metabolized into uric acid, so we know where uric acid stones (the second most common type after calcium carbonate stones) come from in folks like moi. Uric acid stones are the ones that are shaped like shale (ow, trust me), calcium carbonate ones are usually round, and I just have to pity the poor shmucks that get struvite (or staghorn) type stones (the name says it all for those, doesn't it? Mega-ow).

To make a long (and painful) story short, the diet was intended to reduce granular emissions from my pee pee. It generally worked pretty well.

Alas, I've lapsed since my joyous reunion with my chickie-friend and started consuming the flesh of deceased critters again. I'll probably go back on the diet I was on over the past year again as soon as "sane roadie weather" settles in again.

Oh yeah, and before anyone says it, I am fully aware that consuming seafood is another risk for the stone-prone. Thar's danger in them thar purines! I mean it's not like I was (or currently am) consuming a buttload of fish (by the way, legumes are in the same boat as fish!). According to some experts reducing purine-heavy high protein foods can reduce the chances of a "fouled barrel."

I'm not naive enough to think that 10 months or so off "the hard stuff" (chicken, pork, dead cows, and other roadkilled items) actually did any good for said tasty species, but it sure did make me feel spiffy--virile, too, but I know nobody wants to read about any of that business.

[PutAwayWet]

Someone else said it - variety is the key to every successful diet. Whether or not that diet includes meat, it should include as great a variety of different type foods as possible to make sure that you get what you need of all types of nutrients. And the less processed the food, the better it is for you - that's a rule to live by.

[Ripp]

PAW, the organic vs trad. farming was what I alluded to in my post where I decided not to hijack the thread. I too buy almost all organic produce, the flesh is too expensive. Anybody want to continue this in a new thread?

[PutAwayWet]

PAW, the organic vs trad. farming was what I alluded to in my post where I decided not to hijack the thread. I too buy almost all organic produce, the flesh is too expensive. Anybody want to continue this in a new thread?

I could go for a good discussion on organic stuff.

[VRX200]

Leviticus 11
1And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,

2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.

3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.

[INDIGOSKY]

Leviticus 11
1And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,

2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.

3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.

Or we could eat bugs...

20 " 'All flying insects that walk on all fours are to be detestable to you. 21 There are, however, some winged creatures that walk on all fours that you may eat: those that have jointed legs for hopping on the ground. 22 Of these you may eat any kind of locust, katydid, cricket or grasshopper. 23 But all other winged creatures that have four legs you are to detest.



oh wait, aren't most animals already dead when you eat them? Guess you will be unclean till evening!

39 " 'If an animal that you are allowed to eat dies, anyone who touches the carcass will be unclean till evening. 40 Anyone who eats some of the carcass must wash his clothes, and he will be unclean till evening. Anyone who picks up the carcass must wash his clothes, and he will be unclean till evening.

Point being, Bible quotes, when taken out of context of time and place are silly at best, and just plain wrong at worst.

Let the sh!tstorm begin...

[tryandgetme]

Anyone who picks up the carcass must wash his clothes, and he will be unclean till evening.

Anyone who's ever cleaned a deer knows that picking up a dead bleeding carcass means you're not clean anymore and you have to wash your clothes when you get home that night BECAUSE THERE'S BLOOD ALL OVER THE PLACE. :D

[Jay13]

Leviticus also says somewhere that children who curse their parents should be put to death, and other equally ridiculous stuff.

Taking the bible literally is scary. Taking it literally, selectively, is even worse...

Who mentioned a shitstorm?

[HempKnight]

I also believe that a balanced diet consists of meat and veggies, and have been focusing more on wise choices than trendy lifestyle labels. I do, however make it a policy to only eat meats from animals who either have died from natural causes or taken their own lives.Why did the chicken cross the road? To make me some Parmigiana,naturally. It DOES make the process of acquiring meat a lot more tedious, but I sleep better. Sometimes, I'll trace the remains of animals i've purchased for consumption,to garner more guilt-free goods. In fact i have a surplus of leather key fobs,13 baseballs,4 belts,two pairs of gloves, and a dominatrix- inspired undergarment thingy(which i still cant figure out which end is up) just from a Familypack of t-bones I picked up last summer.I may never use the other items,but at least I know I've made a difference.:p